Fucked up way Oklahoma Indian Casinos steal from the players

I worked about 5 years in Oklahoma at Various Casinos, the last few years as a card room manager. My girlfriend is now the Table games manager at a Casino up on the Northern boarder.

In the poker rooms it's pretty common for the casino to make 2 drops during a hand, the $4 rake on the right and the $1 player promotion on the left. The player promotion money is the players money not the Casinos. This money is to be used for promotions, Bad beat jackpot etc. I've seen the money used to buy cars, feed the players, bu WSOP seats etc. The problem with this now is that the Casinos are stealing this money in a round about way.

The last casino I worked at has got into the entertainment business. They've been holding outdoor concerts, and MMA events. I would be surprised if the Casino gets 200 people who pay for tickets. The casino makes the blackjack pit and poker room buy tickets and give them away to it's players. The problem with this is they charge $150 a person for general admission tickets and up to $500 for VIP ( A folding table close to the action). This should be a fucking crime and it seems as if theirs nothing anyone can do about it.

It's even worse in Blackjack because in Oklahoma they charge a .50 ante per hand bet. This money is the houses take. The State is suppose to get a percentage of the winnings off bets and the rest is suppose to be returned to the players. However the Casinos entertainment company takes it all with overpriced tickets.

100% of the ante (and its .50 PER $100 wagered) goes to the state of Oklahoma. No money is supposed to be returned to players although their promotional budget is regulated by legislature.

This is untrue. I don't know much about anything else but I do know Indian gaming in Oklahoma.

The ante does not go to the state. The ante is how we get away with having blackjack in Oklahoma. Also the ante isn't a set in stone amount, I've worked at different casinos that charge different amounts. All the money lost wagering has to go into the "player pool" and the player pool amount must be posted in the pit. The house is allowed to charge an administrative charge for keeping up with the player pool, the state gets a chunk, and you can take out a certain percentage for wages, The rest is the players money.. I no longer remember the actual percentages but that is the way it is broken down.

They're basicly skipping around the law that says you can't have Casino banked card games. They're setting it up as the players banking the game and charging a fee to let them play.

This is why the Casino makes the blackjack pit buy 250 tickets per MMA fight for $500 each. so they not only collect the ante, they get the player pool money as well.

It was also said we couldn't have dice games so that's where the card craps game into play. Buffalo Run decided they would tip toe around this buy having you roll the dice, and if you rolled a 5 and a 2 they would pull a 5 and 2 out of the deck and you "played the cards" . This is about the only time a Casino has not gotten away with skirting the laws here as they shut that one down rather quickly.



Another thing that's screwy is their isn't an Oklahoma gaming comission. Each tribe is in charge of setting up their own gaming comission. They set up their own rules and regulations and send them off to the National Indian Gamin comission for approval. However instead of the state overseeing these the tribes are allowed to do it themselves so anything goes.


At least three American Indian tribes have begun offering gambling designed to further blur the distinction between Oklahoma and Las Vegas casinos.

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State and federal regulators said they are investigating the casinos, all in northeast Oklahoma, to determine whether the games are legal under a law that state voters passed in 2004.

That law allows for non-house-banked card games, or those in which the casino has no stake in the outcome.

However, it specifically prohibits dice games and roulette wheels.

The Quapaw Tribe went so far as to patent its craps game and is collecting fees from casinos owned by the Osage and Seneca-Cayuga tribes, said JR Matthews, the Quapaws' vice chairman.

In addition, the Seneca-Cayugas' Grand Lake Casino also installed a roulette game, including a wheel.

Legal boundaries sought
State Finance Director Claudia San Pedro, whose office oversees tribal gaming compacts, said she is working with the attorney general's office to further define what is legal and what isn't.

"We think the law's clear," she said. "But if there needs to be further clarification, we need to do that."

Matthews said the dice "tell which cards are used. ... Even though we throw dice, the dice aren't what speaks."

"It gets pretty complicated," Matthews said.

He said before installing the game in the tribe's Miami, OK, casino, the game was demonstrated for regulators from San Pedro's office.

"They said, 'Well, it looks like a non-house-banked card game.' ... It's just a version that we were able to get the state gaming people to agree to," Matthews said.

"That's not correct," San Pedro said in response. "We told them they could play non-house-banked card games, but they had to be card games. ... If it's not truly a card game, then it's obviously a serious problem."

Matthews said his tribe's casino offers craps just three nights a week because Oklahoma players haven't grown accustomed to it.

"It just gives you more ambiance of a casino," Matthews said.

In Las Vegas-style craps, a player uses two dice to roll a combined number between two and 12. Certain numbers are winners, while others are losers. Other gamblers wager on what the roller will roll next.

At the Seneca-Cayugas' casino, craps has been available for six months and roulette for three months, said Mike Brown, a casino manager.

Brown said the craps game there is based on cards, and dice are tossed "more for show."

However, a reporter who visited Thursday night saw no cards being used. Another check on Friday night showed the games being played with the cards.

A sign below the craps table indicated a minimum bet of $2 and a maximum of $100.

Three female employees worked at the table. One put chips on numbers chosen by players. Another gathered dice with a hooked stick. The third handed pieces of paper to losing gamblers. The slip entitled losing players to enter a drawing where the casino offered prizes.

The Osage Nation's Million Dollar Elm casinos have begun advertising the craps game on a Web site and in a Tulsa weekly newspaper.

Officials from the Osage casinos didn't return a phone call seeking comment. Chief Jim Gray said he didn't know enough about the games to comment.

The craps and roulette games involving cards aren't unique to Oklahoma. Some tribal casinos in California have begun using them, as well. State regulators there have determined the games are legal as long as the outcome is determined by cards.

However, the language in that state's tribal gambling law may differ from Oklahoma's, state officials said.

All i know is an ante for Blackjack is

G
A
Y

I guess my casino host at Winstar is a liar. Sorry donkey.

Yes it's fucking Gay.

Gamble it's pretty common for the Casinos to tell the players that they have to charge an ante.
I've even seen a few smaller casinos that don't charge an anted to the player. As usual they have a technical work around where they do charge an ante but they charge it to the player pool every hand and run it as a "no ante" promotion. Basicly the player is still paying it but they're just not handing it to the dealer every time.