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Limit hand, hand reader needed

Epistate
post Nov 14 2008, 04:00 PM
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Live 15/30

I am moving into the game from a broken game. Transferring chips and trying to eat sweet and sour chicken at the same time so obv Im playing tighter than normal until I at least get situated. I get KK and rai in MP and blinds call.

Flop K36 two diamonds. Chk, Chk, I bet and SB raises BB folds, I 3 bet he calls. SB is prob one of the most solid regulars that I play with on a consistent basis.

Turn 8(K36) offsuit. He leads again and I raise, he calls.

River J of diamonds (8K36). He leads again...? I have the King of diamonds btw.







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PAYforUSC
post Nov 14 2008, 09:31 PM
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value raise, even for full ring imo.

edit-i still call 3 bet since pot is so big obv.


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repoman
post Nov 14 2008, 09:38 PM
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I'm terrible at poker, but I like playing these "what would you do" posts... you said he's a solid regular, and you have the Kd, so that takes away AdKd, so I say he's on set of 6's, so value raise, then tilt call his re-rai and he slow-rolls over the 4d5d PullingHairOut.gif
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Big_Nig
post Nov 15 2008, 04:30 PM
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raise 100%


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PinchHitter
post Nov 15 2008, 06:20 PM
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Hes prolly just betting for value with a non flush hand. I feel like he might checkraise with a flush since he knows you are strong and will value bet if checked to. Raise.
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scrippy77
post Nov 15 2008, 07:44 PM
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As others have said, definitely value-raise. His lead on the turn does not really indicate a flush draw.
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DanDruff
post Nov 19 2008, 06:03 AM
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You having the king of diamonds is the clincher.

It means he didn't call from the SB with KX diamonds.

The check-raise followed by the lead on the turn (when a non-diamond hit) meant that he didn't want you getting a free card if on a flush draw.

The lead on the river meant that he didn't want you pulling the raise-turn-free-showdown trick.

Looks like 2 pair or a lower set to me.

So yes, definitely value raise.
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kouta43
post Nov 19 2008, 05:21 PM
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I think this is either two pair or a flush, although a flush doesnt really fit in with a solid reg's play- there is some chance he had a pair and a flush draw on the flop with 6d7d or something similar and he was semi bluff leading the turn although i dont think thats likely. I also dont think he flopped a set as he would most likely three bet the turn w 66 or 33.

My guess: KJ.
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repoman
post Nov 19 2008, 11:43 PM
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cmon epi, don't hold out on us.

bump
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reggiman
post Nov 20 2008, 06:19 AM
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I'm gonna say KJ here. 45d also possible but solid live players don't usually defend that hand in the sb where online players might, and the line for that hand is a bit weird.

He def prolly has you on AK here, but if he did have KJ it's a def cr on river for him and he played it bad.


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Epistate
post Nov 20 2008, 09:35 AM
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He had Q9 of diamonds for a flush.


I raised the river quickly and he just called asking if I had AK of diamonds. I'm glad I didn't think about it or surely I would have gotten 3 bet.



I didn't really think about what he could of had and was wondering if I had made a mistake or not by not doing so more in depth (although taking any time to think about it would have likely cost me another bet). Once he bet out on the turn I made the assumption he was drawing dead since donking the turn is a weird line for him to take. I'm still not sure what his overall plan was for the hand besides maybe winning the hand if a diamond doesn't come if Im also on the draw. I know he has been losing for a month though so that could be the reason for the weird line.


Trying to put him on a hand isn't easy though since the KJ is the only thing that can have that makes sense and all the kings would be out so its likely I can only beat one hand.
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reggiman
post Nov 20 2008, 09:56 AM
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QUOTE(Epistate @ Nov 20 2008, 05:35 PM) *
He had Q9 of diamonds for a flush.


I raised the river quickly and he just called asking if I had AK of diamonds. I'm glad I didn't think about it or surely I would have gotten 3 bet.



I didn't really think about what he could of had and was wondering if I had made a mistake or not by not doing so more in depth (although taking any time to think about it would have likely cost me another bet). Once he bet out on the turn I made the assumption he was drawing dead since donking the turn is a weird line for him to take. I'm still not sure what his overall plan was for the hand besides maybe winning the hand if a diamond doesn't come if Im also on the draw. I know he has been losing for a month though so that could be the reason for the weird line.


Trying to put him on a hand isn't easy though since the KJ is the only thing that can have that makes sense and all the kings would be out so its likely I can only beat one hand.


Jump on AIM niggat


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sonatine
post Nov 20 2008, 01:54 PM
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QUOTE(reggiman @ Nov 21 2008, 04:56 AM) *
QUOTE(Epistate @ Nov 20 2008, 05:35 PM) *
He had Q9 of diamonds for a flush.


I raised the river quickly and he just called asking if I had AK of diamonds. I'm glad I didn't think about it or surely I would have gotten 3 bet.



I didn't really think about what he could of had and was wondering if I had made a mistake or not by not doing so more in depth (although taking any time to think about it would have likely cost me another bet). Once he bet out on the turn I made the assumption he was drawing dead since donking the turn is a weird line for him to take. I'm still not sure what his overall plan was for the hand besides maybe winning the hand if a diamond doesn't come if Im also on the draw. I know he has been losing for a month though so that could be the reason for the weird line.


Trying to put him on a hand isn't easy though since the KJ is the only thing that can have that makes sense and all the kings would be out so its likely I can only beat one hand.


Jump on AIM niggat


respectfully, raising that river is a monsterous leak live.

live 15 players do not bet there without the flush. maybe 5% of the time you run into 2pr, an underset RR's you on the turn as does AA and occasionally AK in the hands of someone spewey.


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Chinamaniac
post Nov 20 2008, 03:39 PM
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I bet he rolls over Q9 of diamonds
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KillAllHumans
post Nov 21 2008, 11:19 AM
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i raise river


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SetofKs
post Nov 21 2008, 12:23 PM
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I would've just called the river, but im a pussy like that.
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SetofKs
post Nov 21 2008, 01:38 PM
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If you raise and he 3 bets do you have a discipline to fold? I never seem to be able to, thats probably why I only call here.
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MrJones
post Nov 22 2008, 07:00 PM
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given his line I def. raise / call river.


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Dmoss
post Nov 22 2008, 08:41 PM
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QUOTE(sonatine @ Nov 20 2008, 03:54 PM) *
QUOTE(reggiman @ Nov 21 2008, 04:56 AM) *
QUOTE(Epistate @ Nov 20 2008, 05:35 PM) *
He had Q9 of diamonds for a flush.


I raised the river quickly and he just called asking if I had AK of diamonds. I'm glad I didn't think about it or surely I would have gotten 3 bet.



I didn't really think about what he could of had and was wondering if I had made a mistake or not by not doing so more in depth (although taking any time to think about it would have likely cost me another bet). Once he bet out on the turn I made the assumption he was drawing dead since donking the turn is a weird line for him to take. I'm still not sure what his overall plan was for the hand besides maybe winning the hand if a diamond doesn't come if Im also on the draw. I know he has been losing for a month though so that could be the reason for the weird line.


Trying to put him on a hand isn't easy though since the KJ is the only thing that can have that makes sense and all the kings would be out so its likely I can only beat one hand.


Jump on AIM niggat


respectfully, raising that river is a monsterous leak live.

live 15 players do not bet there without the flush. maybe 5% of the time you run into 2pr, an underset RR's you on the turn as does AA and occasionally AK in the hands of someone spewey.


I'm going to have to respectfully disagree... Having played a shit ton of live 15/30... good 15/30 players would lead there often, even though the bet, call a raise on the turn... lead the river line seems kinda odd (if it's actually not a flush) Many players would lead there with any two pair, and any set most of the time. Having no read on the player I'm assuming (since he just showed to the table) you definitely have to raise. You are just missing extra bets not raising there in the long run.
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Dmoss
post Nov 22 2008, 08:42 PM
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QUOTE(SetofKs @ Nov 21 2008, 03:38 PM) *
If you raise and he 3 bets do you have a discipline to fold? I never seem to be able to, thats probably why I only call here.


If he 3 bets you call. I think it's really that simple... Just calling is incredibly tight.
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